Liz Moorehead
Episode Transcript
Liz Moorehead (00:01.959)
Welcome back to Beyond Your Default. I'm your host, Liz Morehead. And as always, I'm joined by the one, the only, my favorite chaos gremlin in my whole world, George B. Thomas. Good morning, George. See, see, see, people who do not know you, people who do not know you, that sounded so innocuous. Good morning, Liz. No, no, that, those are the words of an architect of danger.
George B. Thomas (00:15.223)
Hi Liz. Good morning, how are you doing this morning?
George B. Thomas (00:30.816)
Yeah, I'm wearing purple today. I don't know if that lets anybody know anything, but it is a purple day.
Liz Moorehead (00:35.643)
Whenever you're wearing purple, whenever you're wearing purple, like if you're wearing orange, red, white, black, those are colors I can work with. Like I know, I know your hoodie hat combos, right? And for those who see, for those who do not know George also, this man's lid and hoodie game is always on point. Color matched hats and hoodies at all times. But when it's a purple day, when it's a purple day,
George B. Thomas (00:43.789)
Yeah.
George B. Thomas (00:47.543)
let's see.
George B. Thomas (01:03.756)
Watch out.
Liz Moorehead (01:06.865)
So just for our listeners at home, I'm happy to be here with you this week. This is also a cry for help. Just throwing that out there. But George, while I just, while I just, that's also a lie. While I strap in my little podcast seatbelt, what's your high and low for this week? Where are we at?
George B. Thomas (01:14.39)
Yeah, I'll be nice. I'll be good. I promise.
George B. Thomas (01:27.126)
Yeah, so the low for me this week is I feel like I've been having a little bit of what I'll call an identity crisis or just struggling a little bit mentally. And I've, you know, the good thing is I had a chance to talk to my daughter and my wife last night about it because everybody could kind of tell that I was like, eh, the,
George versus like the normal George. And so I've just been struggling with like this massive weight of what I'm trying to bring to the world. Am I good enough? Is it sustainable? Like all of these things. The the funny thing is that this episode comes at the most appropriate time for me to be. Yeah, to.
Liz Moorehead (02:22.137)
It always does. It always does.
George B. Thomas (02:24.726)
Like as I was like prepping for it, I'm like, man, I needed to see this, hear this, know this, believe this. But my highlight would definitely be just the ability to have somebody to talk through with it, to have some understanding around it. And then I came to this realization, like my own words came back to me, right? And I suddenly started to feel a little bit better.
when my own words came back to me and I've said to many people through the years, like when you're getting close to where you're supposed to be, life is gonna get more difficult. And so then when it came to my brain, I was like, well, no wonder I'm struggling the last couple of weeks because I feel like I'm getting really close.
to where I'm supposed to be, what I'm supposed to be doing, what I'm supposed to be giving birth to. And so it makes sense that I might mentally be struggling with the weight of which it is. there was, that's me in a nutshell over the past week, maybe even two weeks. What about you, Liz? What highlight, lowlight? My highlight is that having somebody to talk to about this situation and
Liz Moorehead (03:38.951)
Wait, but what's your high- wait, but what's your highlight?
Liz Moorehead (03:45.981)
God.
George B. Thomas (03:47.82)
that my own words kind of came back to me. It's weird when you have the potential or ability to be your own mentor in life. Like, anyway.
Liz Moorehead (04:02.657)
God, let's see, you know, since we always pride ourselves on being a thousand percent honest on this podcast, particularly with what you... Yeah, cause do you know how much I want to give some sort of like, you know, this is my highlight, this is my low light, this is my whatever. So instead we're just gonna get Liz unfiltered by highlight and my low light are exactly the same thing. I met someone and I hate it and I like it. Yeah.
George B. Thomas (04:09.654)
Which is difficult sometimes.
George B. Thomas (04:29.816)
All at the same moment.
Liz Moorehead (04:34.902)
I'm so mad about it. I'm so mad about it. Cause like, you know, a couple of weeks ago, I took a week off from life. All I did was work or hiking in the woods. I went to go visit an area where I knew a lot of people and I purposefully did not tell anybody I was there. The only people who knew I was there were the people who I was house sitting for. Right?
George B. Thomas (04:43.244)
Yeah, yeah.
Liz Moorehead (05:00.283)
And I spent a lot of time thinking about, we're done surviving. We're done with that now. We're done using like, let's talk about the past years. No, we're done with all of that now. So what is it we're doing? Where do we wanna go? What are we calling in? We did all of this brutal bloody work to rip out toxicity from the root in your life. Nature abhors a vacuum.
George B. Thomas (05:19.168)
Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (05:29.064)
So before you start calling back in the same crap you just pulled out, maybe just think about work, life, love, what is it you really want? So I wrote it down. So I wrote it down. Life and love, all these things. Like, you know, what is a perfect day look like from a work perspective? Who are the people I want to be devoting my energy to both personally and professionally? Like with you, you know, of course, George is always on that list.
George B. Thomas (05:40.116)
As one should, should, yeah. Journal it.
George B. Thomas (05:57.976)
aren't you nice?
Liz Moorehead (05:59.197)
And then of course I wrote down, who is this guy? Right? I even gave him a fake name because I'm like, I just can't talk to Vapor. So I gave him a fake name and I said, so he's this guy. This is who he is. And then I said, okay, I'm ready. Sounds great.
George B. Thomas (06:06.802)
Mmm.
Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (06:15.331)
Met him a week later.
George B. Thomas (06:17.24)
See? See how the universe works? I'm telling you.
Liz Moorehead (06:20.109)
mad about it. So mad about it, but I'm also happy about it. And that's what I'm going to say for right now. What I will say is that it is very interesting how if you stop trying to be such a flipping control freak about everything and not controlling what an outcome is, no, we will. We will be doing that. We will, because I have lots of thoughts.
George B. Thomas (06:23.65)
Yeah.
George B. Thomas (06:37.654)
Hmm.
George B. Thomas (06:41.814)
Have we done a control episode? wow, yeah, we should do that.
Liz Moorehead (06:49.221)
We both had a discussion this weekend where it's like, this is exactly what I wanted and completely unexpected packaging, like antithetical packaging. So where will this go? I don't know. We're going to find out. It's going to be great. But yeah, so my highlight and my low light is how dare you universe. I told you what I wanted and you listened. How dare you? You're the best, God. Love it.
George B. Thomas (07:02.434)
Yeah.
George B. Thomas (07:08.096)
Mmm.
Yeah, thank you God. Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (07:16.187)
So yeah, that's my highlight and my low light, but let's get into what you teased before, which is this podcast has just a sneaky little habit, sneaky little habit. Like all of the topics always aligning with what it is that we need to be talking about. Now we, we already teased for our listeners, if you've been listening for any length of time, what we're going to be talking about over the next few weeks. So we've talked a lot about the superhuman framework, which is a
George B. Thomas (07:21.143)
Yeah.
George B. Thomas (07:28.638)
It really does. It really does.
Liz Moorehead (07:43.301)
a little gathering, a little cloister, if you will, of 10 daily habits and qualities that we cultivate, right? So hunger, holiness, helpfulness, humanity, humor, all of these little bits and pieces that allow us to architect a life beyond our default, right? And when we say beyond our default, it means we're done living the life we think we should. We're done with that. We did that. Didn't work. Not doing that anymore. We're here to do what lights us up, right?
George B. Thomas (08:05.824)
Yeah, yeah.
George B. Thomas (08:12.41)
Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (08:12.999)
But if we think about any sort of endeavor, right? Like George, to use an analogy that you and I like to, that we feel more comfortable with. We are in the marketing space and your tools and your technology are really helpful, right? Your tools, your marketing automation systems, your sales CRM systems, your, the website platform you choose to host on. All of these things are really important, but they don't
George B. Thomas (08:24.792)
Yeah. Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (08:42.203)
really mean anything or do anything for you if the strategy you're putting into it is crappy, if you don't have a strategy, if you don't have a vision, if you don't have a why. And so over the next few weeks, we're going to be talking about what we discussed in the last episode, which are the four, or two episodes ago actually, the four cornerstones of the superhuman framework, right? Purpose, passion.
George B. Thomas (08:53.391)
Yeah.
George B. Thomas (09:03.859)
you
Yeah. Yep.
Yep. Yep. Yeah, but not that kind of love.
Liz Moorehead (09:11.111)
persistence and love baby, love. But it can't be that kind of love. It can be love, you know, but we're talking about purpose today. Purpose, the driving force that gives meaning to our actions, right? It's the why behind everything that we do, providing the clarity and the motivation that goes beyond our day-to-day tasks at a high level purpose is that tether, that connection.
George B. Thomas (09:17.556)
I mean, yeah.
George B. Thomas (09:27.574)
Yeah, yep.
Liz Moorehead (09:40.605)
for our actions with a deeper sense of meaning. But here's what makes purpose so important. Cause you know, I'm a big numbers girlie. I love data. I hear somebody say something out in the paper. I'm like, aha, so where's the data to support that? Is there research, right? Purpose is what makes our goals more than just, yep, we need those. Purpose is what makes our goals more than a checklist. For example, there was a study that was done by the journal of clinical psychiatry.
George B. Thomas (09:49.494)
Yeah. Yeah.
George B. Thomas (09:54.904)
Mmm.
Yeah, the numerals. Yep.
Liz Moorehead (10:09.999)
and individuals who have a strong sense of purpose report lower levels of depression and higher life satisfaction. And conversely, 25 % of people report feeling a lack of purpose contributing to higher stress levels and dissatisfaction. But it gets even crazier. So it's not just psychological. It also attaches to our physical health, a study published by the Journal of American Medical Association, which has the greatest acronym ever, JAMA. I love that. It makes me happy.
George B. Thomas (10:37.703)
yeah. Mm. Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (10:39.855)
showed that people who have a clear sense of purpose are associated with a 15 % lower risk of death. What? But it's also on the flip side, right? Purpose is this beautiful thing that we all want to be able to define for ourselves, be able to find for ourselves, but it's not always easy. And a survey conducted by the Institute for Life Purpose found that 69 % of people say they struggle to define their life purpose, and 50 % of millennials, that's me.
George B. Thomas (11:07.115)
Hmm
Liz Moorehead (11:07.919)
express a desire to find a job where their work aligns with a sense of purpose, something that has only increased in the post pandemic era. So that is what today's conversation is all about. We are exploring what it means to live with purpose, how to find it, especially when that path forward isn't always clear. So George, I want to turn it over to you. Real softball to start things off. You know me, I love a good softball. So.
George B. Thomas (11:14.528)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (11:35.045)
What has this journey been like for you in discovering your purpose? You know, just take us there.
George B. Thomas (11:39.032)
you gotta redefine what you call a softball, first of all. listen, my journey to discovering my purpose has been this winding road full of twists and turns, definitely a lot of experimentation, like test everything, try it. Liz, as I thought about this question, I've worn so many hats, right?
military guy, restaurant worker, furniture store employee, and even in that was like from warehouse guy, manager, district manager. I was even a manager of a water park, a horse riding instructor, a camp counselor, a bouncer, a youth pastor, a designer, a developer, a video editor, and eventually became the HubSpot guy. Like, and as I'm doing that list, I'm like, yeah, that's a lot.
By the way, that's only a fraction. I didn't go into specifics of like what restaurants and this that. But here's the thing over the 12, the past 12 years now, I've been this HubSpot guy and you almost have to like stop and go why? Because anything for me has not really ever lasted 12 years, has not really had any link. Like if you take the mathematical probability of all the things that I listed.
It's a short period of time. This HubSpot, this inbound, this HubSpot guy, 12 years because it's given me a space where my purpose could take root and my purpose had a place to flourish. You see, HubSpot or inbound has become this playground where I could educate others, help them grow, and be the catalyst that I'd always been searching to become.
I talk about like leaving people better than I found them. And this is literally the place that this has been able to happen. It was literally the first time that all of the scattered pieces that I referenced earlier of my life, like they began to make sense. Like, I was this because of that and I use this piece of that for this. And so what's fun is
George B. Thomas (14:00.074)
even though was twisty and turny in this crazy road, like everything actually ends up aligning in a way that felt kind of authentic and fulfilling when you get to the point where you actually find your purpose and are leveraging it.
but
George B. Thomas (14:20.14)
listen, I'm just going to be real honest, getting to that point, getting to this point wasn't easy. And even being in this point, as I referenced in the beginning of this podcast, sometimes even being at this point isn't the easiest. But at least you have the purpose, right? Like throughout all those jobs and identities, by the way, because you have to realize there's almost like another side of this coin.
the identities during this time frame, skateboarder, rapper, sales guy, cowboy, evangelist, agency employee. Like, I went through some serious like, who am I really?
But and at those points I look like was I living an authentic life or was I just shape shifting into whatever freaking role I found myself in and just trying to fit in. I mean, for the longest time, I thought I was being fake, to be honest with you, like and I've told this story on the podcast before about like a chameleon, right? Like changing my colors, but not in a good way. And I felt like I was blending in.
wherever I went and never really standing out or being true to myself. Liz, I don't know if I've said on the podcast, but I've told this story about how even one time in my career, somebody told me that I needed to turn down the light a little bit because I was giving people a sunburn. and, but I need to let the light shine. I need to be my true self.
But all of this like identities and the things happening and the not being aligned with my purpose, like it left me with a lot of questions. Things like, what do I actually need to be happy? What is it that will bring me joy? Not just in like these moments, but like lasting real joy for like a long time. What am I passionate about?
George B. Thomas (16:23.436)
I mean, let's be honest, I could be passionate about everything. I am built in that way and I understand that I gotta be careful because I'll put myself in so many situations doing so many things because I just feel like I wanna be passionate about that. It's slightly a superpower because it makes me a transition specialist, but it's also an evil enemy because if I don't watch out, I can easily burn out. But it took me a long time to kind of wrestle with these questions and...
honestly face the discomfort that came with those questions. And I would I would beg the listeners to think of those questions for themselves and spend time in that discomfort as they journey to trying to figure out the purpose. But but here's the thing, we get to we get to the point where I can say and then there was HubSpot, which sounds weird that that's what I would say as far as like tying it to life. But like
It's not remissed on me that over a decade of learning, over a decade of growing, over a decade of figuring things out, no more of this sporadic all over the place way that I used to learn and do, but there's been this level of intentionality. And honestly, when you have this learning, this growing, this figuring things out, that's when things really started clicking.
The role wasn't just a job. It became the space where I could continuously evolve and grow into something better, whether I was at the sales line or was whether I was at Impulse Creative or whether now like owning my own company at Sidekick Strategy. It's it's evolving and growing and we're focused on this beyond the default, right? We're focused on the better. It allows me purpose and understanding my purpose allows me to show up as my best self.
which by the way, let's just get to the brass tacks here, an educator, a guide, a catalyst for others. That's my purpose. Like if I can put myself in a space where I can educate, guide, and become the catalyst for their growth path.
George B. Thomas (18:43.424)
And so what's fun is like this journey hasn't been about finding a job title or, no, it's like deeper. And we'll talk about passion next week, but it's about aligning my passion for growth and education with the platform that let me do it every single day for almost the last 12 years. And it's...
Also been this realization that those previous roles, all that searching, I shouldn't hate myself for that. It wasn't wasted. All of that historical like searching and turmoil and twists and turns was building me up piece by piece for, for this, for this great purposeful moment in life. And so Liz, to answer your question, my journey before discovering my purpose was a long,
and windy road filled with countless roles and identity shifts. But it wasn't until I found my purpose and this understanding that I truly could educate, inspire growth, and be a catalyst for others that all of those pieces of my life finally aligned. And it's really allowing me to live out my passion and purpose.
in a very authentic and honest way every single day.
Liz Moorehead (20:15.613)
In our initial conversation, when we were first talking about the four different cornerstones, you referred to purpose as a compass, a metaphor that, you know, on its face makes a lot of sense, right? Especially given what we've already discussed so far. But I'd be curious, how does that metaphor play out in real life, specifically when things get tough?
George B. Thomas (20:28.876)
Yeah. Yeah. And when I talk about being a compass, what I'm talking about is being a guiding force that keeps you pointed in the right direction, especially when things get tough.
Listen in real life when challenges hit whether it's career setbacks and identity crisis or those moments where everything feels off track by the way It's exactly what I was talking about that. I've been feeling for the last two weeks. It just feels off track It doesn't feel quite right. I don't know if I'm good enough The only thing that has helped me keep my sanity
is that I have this purpose that grounds me. And I understand no matter how I feel, this is the direction that I need to go. And I have this compass. And so because I have this compass that is my purpose of educating, guiding, and being a catalyst, I then can realize in real life that it's not about having all the answers. It's not about knowing exactly how things will play out, because I have zero clue and
I'm also trying to live in a space where I'm trying to not control the things that are happening through these experiments that I'm doing. But it is about having a direction that I can always return to. Right? So again, for me, in this real world scenario of like struggling and feeling like it's not clicking on all cylinders, for me, my purpose is educating and helping others grow. And
What's fun is when you unpack all of this, you start to realize, my God, this is why I love doing interviews. This is why love creating HubSpot tutorials. This is why I have so many podcasts like this one and Hub Heroes and Wake Up With AI is like, because it is a position where I can apply my purpose for educating and helping others grow. Like these are my catalyst outlets. These are the ways that I live my purpose.
George B. Thomas (22:47.862)
So Liz, when things get messy or I start to like question, again, the last two weeks of my life, Perfectly Timed podcast.
I'm still on the right path because I can sit there and look at my compass per se and go, that's right. This is my purpose. And by the way, the reason I'm feeling so uncomfortable, the reason I feel like it's not ticking is because I am passionately chasing my purpose in a bigger project.
And so this purpose, is what then can take me from this like place and it gets me excited to show up and it makes me wake up every day and it makes me want to do the work and it makes me do the work that aligns with my mission. And yes, I'm using the word mission on purpose. You see, Liz and listeners, I feel like HubSpot.
which is weird to say, or this inbound ecosystem, or if I even broadened out this like digital online world we live in, is my mission. And I would even maybe take it further to say, it's my mission field. And when you're on a mission, you need a compass. Because when you're on a mission, you need direction.
And so Liz, to kind of tie this all together, like a compass doesn't stop the storm, but points you in the right direction, purpose works very much the same way for me. Like it's not going to stop the rough times, but it helps me point into the fact of like, yes, keep going. You're headed in the right direction. It doesn't make the tough times disappear. I don't know if there's anything that can actually do that, but this
George B. Thomas (24:44.364)
this leaning in and leveraging and understanding your purpose, it at least gives me, gives you something to navigate towards. It keeps you moving forward, which ties into persistence, which we'll talk about, but helps you keep moving forward even when everything around you feels disjointed or uncertain or scary, whatever word you want to use there. But Liz, I'm...
I'm super curious of your thoughts on this.
Liz Moorehead (25:17.949)
You know, when I think about the idea of a compass, right, it's easy to stay, if we want to like get really heavy handed with the metaphor here for a moment, like let's just go right into it, right? Like you're on a hike, right? It is very easy to stay on trail. It is very easy to stay on map. It is very easy to stay in the right direction when the elements aren't working against you. When it's sunny, when it's not too cold or too hot or raining.
But the moment the elements start getting to you, you could literally have a map right in front of you and know exactly where you're supposed to go and all of a sudden everything feels awful. Everything feels terrible. And when I think about the moments where I have really struggled, now granted I know I made a joke earlier like you need to stop talking about last year, right? But like, that's my, it's my closest point of reference. Why did I keep getting up in the morning?
George B. Thomas (25:52.492)
Yeah. Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (26:13.371)
because I didn't know where I was gonna be six months from that moment, but I knew I had a problem to solve right in front of me. And so I think when we think about purpose, and we're gonna start digging into this in the next question that I have for you. When we think about this purpose, I think sometimes what our concept of what our purpose actually is versus what we have been trained to think it is, we tend to think it's this very big, grandiose thing.
And in some ways it's very simple cookies. it's wildly impactful because it is simple. Right? And so when I think about purpose, the terrain is going to change, the weather is going to change, the time of day is going to change. All of these different things are going to change. All purpose does is tell me, so this is the direction you should be pointed in to solve the problem right in front of you. You don't know.
George B. Thomas (27:02.74)
You
Liz Moorehead (27:08.817)
what the weather's gonna be like on the other side of the ridge when you get there tomorrow morning. You don't know if it's gonna be rocky, lots of roots, high, low. You don't know all of these things. The goal is you don't, I think I've said this to you once, you don't have to know exactly what the kingdom looks like in order to start walking in the right direction. And that's the whole point. The whole point of this is that you don't unlock your purpose.
George B. Thomas (27:29.2)
Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (27:37.551)
And suddenly some big booming voice from the sky is like, you did it, trophy. This is your roadmap to everything that you do. No, it is just simply like, what are the problems you are built to solve more uniquely than anybody else? Right? How does that evolve at different stages of your life? Because your purpose may evolve. Yeah, you know, like things will change. So when I think about this concept of a compass is all it does is make sure I'm still pointed in the right direction when stuff gets hard.
George B. Thomas (27:40.924)
Yeah. yeah.
George B. Thomas (28:06.87)
Yep, as it will.
Liz Moorehead (28:07.493)
And I just look down at my feet and say, okay, well, just solve the problem right in front of me. That's all I need to do because I know I'm pointed in the right direction. I know I'm moving in the right direction, but I don't have to solve anything except what is right in front of me right now. And that's where I get a lot of safety in that.
George B. Thomas (28:20.882)
Yeah, yeah, and I I think that's a huge point because listen, I went through the entire range of like, maybe I just need to throw it all away. Versus how about I just fix this thing right in front of me? Right? And and
Liz Moorehead (28:39.815)
You don't get to throw things away, George. I will go dumpster diving. will pull them out of the.
George B. Thomas (28:41.28)
Yeah, but that's what I, yeah. But that's what I want people to understand is like sometimes we like go into this chaotic all or nothing when it's no, actually it was, you just needed to apply a little duct tape or like fix this one little thing and then you could have got down the road further. It's funny too, Liz, because you mentioned like this idea of purpose doesn't have to be complex.
It can be simple. Now, the parts around your purpose might be complex. Anyway.
Liz Moorehead (29:21.319)
So I'm very excited about this question personally, because to be fair, this is little bit of pot kettle situation, because we love a good worksheet. We love a good workbook. Yeah. But here's the thing.
George B. Thomas (29:30.944)
Are you phoning in for a friend?
Liz Moorehead (29:39.389)
There are so many workbooks, there are so many worksheets, there are entire books, there are podcasts, there are like the amount of media, multimedia, toolkit, download, overload, all of these things that are devoted to the act of defining your purpose. And to be honest, to be honest, you know, I'm not even gonna lie. I'm asking for me and on behalf of all of our listeners. It makes everything feel so impossible.
George B. Thomas (29:41.185)
Yeah.
George B. Thomas (29:45.526)
Yeah. Yeah. So much.
George B. Thomas (29:58.071)
Yeah.
George B. Thomas (30:07.915)
Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (30:08.123)
Right? It makes your purpose this big thing that it's a, how am I supposed to define this? I don't even know what I had for breakfast this morning. We are just white-knuckling it through life. We're just trying to figure this out. So I want to hear from you as someone who has consumed a ton of self-help stuff, from someone who has done a lot of this work for yourself in a very real human, tangible way.
George B. Thomas (30:16.983)
Mm.
Liz Moorehead (30:36.406)
What do you believe are the true steps to defining your purpose, if there's even a process at all?
George B. Thomas (30:42.746)
yeah, yeah. So it's funny, the thing about purpose, like people do make it feel like it's really big or it feels like this
abstract concept that you can't even put your mind around, or it feels like something that you're supposed to check off. I know what my purpose is, and then you move forward. If we stay with this compass that guides you principle that we kind of talked about at beginning of this, purpose is, to me, it's all about aligning with who you truly are.
and building the reality you actually want to live in.
Okay? When you connect with your purpose, it becomes that, and I'll use another analogy, it becomes that anchor that keeps you grounded while also giving you the freedom to grow into the best version of yourself. In other words, the beyond your default version of yourself. And it's not about being that chameleon.
that I struggled with and trying to fit into like every role in every place. It's about finding the role or place that lets you show up as your authentic self or as Liz likes to say, whole beep human, right? And so when I think about a simple way to remind myself of this or teach others about how to do this, Liz, I love using the acronym REAL, R-E-A-L.
George B. Thomas (32:24.236)
real. So let me go ahead and break. Yeah, yeah, let me let me let I thought that might happen during this section, by the way. So let me let me explain this, break this down a little bit. The R stands for reflect. Okay. The first thing that we've got to do is look inward, you're not going to find your purpose out in some guru's workbook worksheet, like that might help unlock you to do this thing of reflect.
Liz Moorehead (32:25.733)
Liz is frantically taking notes. Yep.
George B. Thomas (32:51.468)
but you've got to look inward. This is where you start to ask the big questions. What truly excites you? What brings you joy? What kind of impact do you want to make in the world? And this is where when you're looking inward, you think back to the moments that felt the most meaningful and impactful in your life. This reflection isn't just about figuring things out on paper. It's about kind of tuning into the things that light you up.
and connect with your values. Now, that is if you understand what your core values are and that you're living by those core values. But it's the same way a compass points you in the right direction before you ever start the journey. Purpose starts with clarity and self-awareness. So you need to look inward.
have some self-awareness and start to clear out the clutter in your brain to kind of set the path. The E stands for experiment. Here's the truth. Purpose doesn't always come with a clear roadmap. I love that you use that word a little bit ago, Liz, of like, and here's your roadmap. Ladies and gentlemen, you've got to experiment. You've got to try different things. You've got to jump into new projects.
You've got to explore roles and step outside your comfort zone. Like I used to look at all the things that I had listed out at the beginning of this podcast as negatives, but I have been a great experimenter along the way. This is where you have to let go of the idea that you need to have it all figured out. And you need to give yourself permission to explore. By the way, you're going to have to give yourself a little grace.
in this area. You see, it's very similar to how my journey played out. Going from military guide, a youth pastor, to HubSpot expert. Like, purpose often reveals itself through action.
George B. Thomas (35:02.978)
not just contemplation. You can sit on the couch and contemplate till the cows come home, but sometimes you just have to take action. So my goal here, my hopes is that you dive in and notice what fills you up versus what drains you. The A, by the way, it's not missed that you're having a
visceral response to the things that are coming out my mouth. Yeah, yeah. We'll get into it. I'm like, I can't wait till I'm done with this real talk here. Because Liz is having a visceral response to many of the things coming out my mouth. So A stands for a line. Once you've done some experimenting, once you've looked inward, you're gonna start to see patterns.
Liz Moorehead (35:33.366)
You know, you're telling me to have grace for myself and how dare you? How dare you? Keep going.
George B. Thomas (36:01.036)
And when you see those patterns, now it's time to align. This is when you take those insights that you've gathered and you connect them with your daily actions. It's about making sure that your work, your projects, your lifestyle sync up with your passion and those core values. And when your actions align with your purpose, that's when everything starts to click. That's when your six cylinders, eight cylinders, whatever you wanna throw in there.
You see, you're no longer just moving through the motions. And there are so many humans that are living their life right now, and they're just moving through the motions. When you start to leverage this kind of real and you're aligning, instead of moving through the motions, you're actively living out who you are.
And much like I found my groove through creating podcasts and HubSpot tutorials and interviews, like this was my outlet, it aligns perfectly with my mission to educate and be a catalyst for others. So when you align the patterns from the experiments and you've got that inward looking self-awareness, now it starts to all be together. And the L, it's real simple.
You just need to live. Finally, you need to live it. You need to live that purpose. Once you've aligned your life with your purpose, it's about showing up every single day and committing to that purpose. It's not a one-time discovery. It's not a finish line you cross. It's a practice. Purpose is a practice that you engage with consistently.
day in and day out. It's about embracing your purpose in everything you do. When you live your purpose,
George B. Thomas (38:04.524)
Liz, it's like planting your feet firmly on the ground, knowing who you are, what you're about. And when things get tough or dicey or the waves of life come crashing in, you understand that you're being real.
And by using real reflect, experiment, align and live, you create a process for finding and nurturing your purpose in a way that feels achievable. It feels authentic. And it feels true to who you are and who you're trying to become, because it's not about becoming someone new. And by the way, I we've had this conversation like not on this podcast, but I think like, well, maybe even on this podcast.
Because I was always trying to be the new George. I was trying to forget the old George, the bad George, right? It's not about becoming someone new. It's about uncovering who you've been all along and creating a reality that matches that person. Liz, what are your thoughts?
Liz Moorehead (39:21.437)
I'm just having a big ol' squishy feeling moment because this is one of my favorite things that I talk to a lot of my clients about. You I've had situations where people will thank me and say, my gosh, thank you, I would have never gotten there, you gave me the right words. I mean, you do realize these were your words. This is who you already were. You just needed a permission structure to turn off all the artifice that you felt like you've had to put on every day.
And you and I have had conversations about it. We've had pretty specific and detailed conversations about it of like, you need to stop burying the past and fuse with your past self. You you have to understand that where you are standing right now is because of every step you took before it and not in spite of it either, you know? Again, I will reiterate having grace for myself. How dare you? How dare you? I just think that's rude.
George B. Thomas (39:50.995)
you
George B. Thomas (40:06.225)
Yeah, yeah, yep.
Liz Moorehead (40:16.625)
And I just want to point that out. You did say, however, one of my favorite words, right? And this says to me, yes, we need to have a conversation more structured around control because
George B. Thomas (40:20.828)
Mmm. Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (40:29.689)
It really is an act of discovery as opposed to an act of definition, right? I think, that, because I do see also things like discover your purpose. it's discovery really is about waking up in the morning and understanding what are the triggers you are looking for? What are the measurements you're looking for and doing so from a place of
curiosity. You know, when I think about the moments that really have led me to doing the work that I meant to be doing, which is I consider myself catalyst for catalysts. I'm here to help change the world. Just, yeah, I know, I know it makes you feel good inside. George, I owe you get to take all the credit for that. But in reality, though, when I think about my purpose, I just want to change the world for the people who are meant to change the world. I don't have to change it for anybody else. Like that's, you know, my work is
George B. Thomas (41:09.728)
I love that.
George B. Thomas (41:25.72)
Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (41:28.977)
best accomplished and I know I'm successful often when I'm invisible because my whole goal is to set the conditions for people and organizations that are solving real problems, not imagined ones. And that's really it. But when I think about how I got to this point, it's because I wasn't trying to sit down, like I wouldn't have been able to tell you any of this 24.
George B. Thomas (41:55.381)
Yeah. God.
Liz Moorehead (41:55.737)
wouldn't be able to tell you any of this at 24, because I think there is prologue, there is plot, there are things that we're meant to be doing. And my purpose at that time was just to be a sponge. My purpose was to learn. My purpose was to live the life I was living, which enabled me to do the work that I am doing now. And you brought up something else that I found fascinating. So when I say you go out into the world with a mentality of discovery,
George B. Thomas (42:13.78)
Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (42:22.767)
and no need to define. Like that's the hilarious part, right? It reminds me of our conversation about opposites that we've had before, right? You want life to get easy, do something hard. You want a dessert to sing, add a little salt. If you want to define your purpose, stop trying to define it. Like that's the thing. If you go out into the world with curiosity and say, why don't I make sure I'm listening for the right things? I'm feeling the right things, right?
George B. Thomas (42:35.67)
Yeah, ooh. Yeah. Mm.
Liz Moorehead (42:51.173)
Are you paying attention to what George said earlier, which I think is critically important, something that I've been really working hard on over the last year. What or who is draining you? Why are you giving that attention? Why is your energy going there? Right? You don't have to answer why. You don't have to answer why it's draining you. If it is a persistent, constant drain where for those things or places or people or whatever,
George B. Thomas (43:04.056)
Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (43:20.466)
It's an exception rather than the rule that they're not draining. Step back. Right?
Just start listening to the right pieces and then start listening to what the world tells you. I'm doing most of the work I'm doing today because George will just say little things like, yep, that's what you're doing. Yeah, that right there. You are not the best judge of yourself. You will always see a distorted version of yourself. It's kind of like how we actually don't know what any of our faces really look like because the only interaction we have with it is a mirror, which is inverted.
George B. Thomas (43:33.496)
Mm-hmm
Liz Moorehead (43:56.507)
What is easy to us is magic to other people. We are terrible at defining that for ourselves. If you go out to the world with this backbone of I am going to discover by experiencing, I am going to listen to my body. I am going to listen to what I like to call my inner cupcake. You can call it your intuition, your voice of God. Don't care what you call it. I'm declining. It is a sentient baked good that lives in my belly somewhere, right? If you listen to those things,
George B. Thomas (44:10.904)
Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (44:26.403)
It will tell you you are in the right place at the right time. And it will also tell you when you're not. And then your gifts will be revealed to you. What you are meant to be doing will be revealed to you. And you'll understand it is not something that stays written in permanent marker in front of you. It is something that evolves, right?
My purpose years ago when I was the editor in chief at Impact was to learn and to push myself outside of my comfort zone and to show people that like, look, if I could stand on stage and act like a complete goober and make money, so can you. You can also stand in front of us like a video. My job was to be uncomfortable a lot and to do things I did not enjoy a lot. But that's how it positioned me to do the work I'm doing today. Right.
George B. Thomas (45:14.451)
Yeah.
George B. Thomas (45:23.422)
Yep.
Liz Moorehead (45:24.743)
So that's when I think about it, is that like when I look at all these books, I love some of the questions. I love some of the questions that these worksheets, these workbooks, these things have me think about, but it sets us up sometimes to fail because it makes you feel like you're doing something wrong if you can't get to the last page and have that purpose statement.
George B. Thomas (45:40.332)
Yeah.
George B. Thomas (45:49.26)
Yeah, you gotta keep it simple on honestly, that's what anyway
Liz Moorehead (45:54.897)
I love that, simplify the complex. one of the things, there were two quotes that really jumped out at me and I was doing research on this and that is the first one from Mark Twain. The two most important days in life are the day you were born and the day you find out why. And my favorite part is that I loved that quote, but I also disagreed with that quote because I cannot tell you how many days I've had where I'm like, I'm supposed to be here doing this thing right now, having this conversation. I had that with you when we had the whole ask human conversation. Like, when are you going to show up and be you?
George B. Thomas (45:57.229)
Yeah
George B. Thomas (46:07.003)
Hmm
George B. Thomas (46:23.472)
Yep.
Liz Moorehead (46:24.793)
When do you realize that the friction you've been feeling is not because you are a side character, it's because you've always been a main character and you've just been pretending? Right? Like, but then I also have other things where it's like, I'm supposed to be here right now making this change. Like in another life, I was a beer writer changing legislation in Maryland and now there are breweries that exist because of the work that I did, which has nothing to do with it, you know? And that has nothing to do with anything that I do now. Sometimes your why is going to shift.
George B. Thomas (46:33.278)
Yeah, yeah
George B. Thomas (46:45.735)
Hey, let's Yes.
Liz Moorehead (46:54.737)
And if you're just open-minded and not so closed-minded about what those whys will be, you will not just have two important days of your life, you will have hundreds. But the point of what you are talking about with purpose is that it's this other one that I saw about Henry David Thoreau. It is not enough to be industrious, so are the ants. What are you industrious about?
George B. Thomas (47:04.982)
Yeah. that's good.
Liz Moorehead (47:16.881)
Like, what are you doing? Like, I can't tell you how my purpose will evolve. I can tell you that the problems I've chosen to be working on today, this week, this month, I know these are the right problems. I know these are the right problems I'm supposed to be solving, right? I am rooted where I am. I'm where I'm supposed to be. I am not just industrious. I am not just busy. I am producing.
George B. Thomas (47:36.94)
Yeah.
Liz Moorehead (47:44.029)
I am in alignment with the things that matter to me. So I want to switch gears here for a minute. You've talked about purpose driving persistence. Persistence is another cornerstone of the superhuman framework, which we will be getting to, but I want to understand how purpose sustains you during those moments of doubt and failure. I know we talked about it a bit from like the compass and whatever, but like, again, it is so easy to be like, yes, purpose, why?
Whatever. But when you're starting to doubt yourself, when you are starting to see failures instead of wins from the work you feel like you're supposed to be doing, what happens?
George B. Thomas (48:24.794)
Yeah. Yeah, so there's, there's two things I love in life. One, I love cruise ships and being at sea.
And two, I love a great analogy. So Liz, I'm gonna start this out because we mentioned the anchor before, right? But purpose and around this conversation of persistence, it's like this massively huge unshakable anchor in one's life. It's something that keeps you steady when, since it's an anchor, we'll say waves of doubt and struggle.
start to kind of crash around you.
No matter what, life is gonna throw you storms.
George B. Thomas (49:14.274)
Many storms. My anchor, my purpose, your anchor, your purpose become the beacon that reminds us why we're out there pushing forward, why we're doing what we're doing. Kind like you just mentioned a little bit ago, Liz. It's less about hitting targets and achieving milestones on this one.
And I hope people understand it's about this bigger mission. Whatever your bigger mission is, again, for me, it's to educate, to inspire, to guide others on their own paths to growth. Literally, why we're doing this podcast. When I'm in those moments of doubt, when everything feels off course,
George B. Thomas (50:08.457)
It's almost like I've wandered into like a fog and I can't see the path ahead. And the only thing I can do is come back at that point to purpose.
For me, purpose, it is the light that cuts through that haze, through that fog. It is the thing that shows me the direction, even if the destination is still far off and hidden. Listen, when I think about the superhuman framework, when I think about what we're trying to do with it, who we're trying to take it to, it feels light years away. At the same time, I feel like it's right at my feet.
which is very confusing. And so I could be all over the place. I could be sporadic with it. I could throw it away. I could chop it up. could... But because I have this anchor, even when I'm in this mental storm that I started to share with everybody at the beginning of this podcast, I know that like...
It's gonna be okay. We're gonna get there. We're gonna figure it out. The other thing to around this persistence piece that I want to throw out there, Liz, and I've talked about it again on the podcast before, and I share it with anybody that I can, is a little bit of a belief structure. And I believe fundamentally, there is no such thing as failure. It's lessons.
It's lessons along the way. Like every setback, every detour, I look at it as like, how is it teaching me something valuable? What lesson can I learn in this moment? And not only what lesson can I learn in this moment, but like, how is it preparing me for the next step that I need to take?
George B. Thomas (52:06.358)
This other piece that I need people to kind of embrace and I had to hear my own words and embrace it with this journey that I'm on right now is that sometimes the closer you get to where you're supposed to be, the harder life pushes back. Is that really what you want? Are you really supposed to be here?
You're about to unlock a massive amount of good in the world. Maybe the universe has two sides of it. A yin and a yang. A dark force, if you will. The Darth Vader or Luke Skywalker of life, per se. Whatever it is, I know it's a truth. Like when you get to where you're supposed to be, there's been a hill, a challenge. And so if I take all of that like...
George B. Thomas (53:03.292)
The resistance isn't a sign to give up.
It should be that sign that you're on the brink of something important. Like honestly, when life gets rough,
And I haven't said this for so long and I'm so glad we're doing this podcast episode. I'm preaching to myself right now, by the way, when, when, when life gets rough.
I get excited because I wonder who am I gonna be on the other side of this.
Purpose is a sustaining force. It sustains me in those moments because it's tied to, it's not tied to one specific result or achievement. It's tied to the journey itself. So many times as humans, we get caught up in just the moment and not the momentum.
George B. Thomas (54:13.068)
And I think a lot of this, what we're talking about here with purpose and persistence is it's the creation of momentum through the thing that you're becoming and the thing that you're impacting.
George B. Thomas (54:28.514)
purpose in times when you need persistence.
It is a guide. It's a guide that gets you through the darkness. It's a guide that keeps you pointing towards true north.
Again, it can be something so simple, but it can be something so powerful. And so like when I wake up this morning and I know that I have multiple podcasts that I get to be on, I have the ability to do the thing that I do, knowing that my work and mission are bigger than any temporary setback, that's what fuels my persistence.
It helps me lean into the hard moments. It helps me push through and remind myself that every challenge is just another step on this way to being better, on this way to growing, on this way of breaking through my default.
Liz Moorehead (55:48.699)
George, we need to take a moment for just where you went with us. I have a question that's not in our outline.
George B. Thomas (55:56.298)
Okay. Is it, are you okay?
Liz Moorehead (56:00.007)
How did it feel? No. How did it feel to give your own self-advice in real time?
George B. Thomas (56:09.186)
always love those moments, to be honest with you. Because I know God, the universe, if you're Liz, your inner cupcake, it has this unique way of giving you all the things that you need. And the mind is a wonderful thing that when it provides you that information that you knew,
Liz Moorehead (56:20.377)
It's God and the inner cupcake.
George B. Thomas (56:36.298)
in the time that you need it. I just find that very fascinating. And it's, for me, it's reassuring, it's comforting.
What's interesting is in real time when you realize that there's something that you always say to other people and now you have to say it to yourself, it's also quite humbling.
Liz Moorehead (57:07.165)
For people who struggling to define their purpose, what advice would you give them?
George B. Thomas (57:12.278)
Yeah. I want to be like kind of good luck. No, I don't want to do that. Like it is is difficult. But again, I go back to a couple of things. Keep it simple. Remember, it's a journey. It's not a quick fix. It's not something you're going to discover overnight. It's something that unfolds over time.
It's about exploration. It's about action. It's about reflection. Like, listen, we've already talked about the acronym REAL. I could literally give you that as a straightforward answer to the question that you just gave. But I think there's some other things that we can hit on here that I hope will resonate with you and the listeners. A big part of my life, later part of my life, I wasn't always great at this when I was younger.
is always explore and experiment.
Always explore and experiment. Purpose is not this light switch that you flip on. It is a path that you uncover one step at a time. And so the way that you do that is you dive into new experiences, you try different things, different hobbies, projects, whatever it is. It might be volunteering.
It might be taking on new responsibilities at work. It might be pursuing a creative passion that you've always just felt like you hadn't been given the permission to take. The goal is to explore what excites and energizes you as a human. And as you go through that, pay close attention to what feels fulfilling. Like, the insights of what fills you are invaluable.
George B. Thomas (59:09.656)
And again, just because I can, Liz, give yourself some grace during this exploration and experiment. Listen, it's normal to not get it right the first time. Just know that that's the truth. So the second thing I want to hit here is, because I'm saying experiment, right? And have these experiences. You have to learn from every experience.
Liz Moorehead (59:16.907)
Stop it! No!
George B. Thomas (59:36.994)
Don't view setbacks or moments of doubt as failures. See them as opportunities for growth. Each experience, whether it's a success or a challenge, teaches you something about yourself and something about your path. Which, by the way, are two great questions you could ask yourself on a daily basis. What have I learned about myself today? And what have I learned about the path that I'm on? You see, because those two questions, it's like collecting clues.
that help you refine your purpose over time. And so focus on recognizing the positive patterns. What activities, what environments, what people light you up consistently. These are the guideposts, right? So many time, there's this, think it's the book, The Gap and the Gain, there's so many times that we're in the gap versus the gain. In other words,
Instead of dwelling on what didn't work so dang much, use the positive patterns, the lessons to adjust what you're doing, who you are and how you move forward. Third and final thing I'll say here, and you mentioned open mindedness by the way, earlier in the podcast and I made a big smile. Number three is stay open and patient. Purpose is not a race.
I want you to have this mentality it is more like a crock pot less than a microwave.
Ladies and gentlemen, am here to tell you good things take time to develop. The crock pot. Don't rush the process. Don't put pressure on yourself to have everything figured out immediately. Sometimes the hardest moments, the ones that make you question everything.
George B. Thomas (01:01:30.07)
like the last two weeks of my life, are exactly what bring you closer to your purpose. It's during these times that clarity can emerge. So I beg you in these moments, be patient, stay curious, and trust that purpose will reveal itself as you continue to explore and you continue to learn.
A big piece, I talk about 1 % better each and every day. Remember, it's all about progress, not perfection. So I need you to take one step at a time and allow your purpose to unfold naturally through this exciting journey. Because it's about discovering a life that's beyond the default. A life that feels authentic. A life that feels aligned. A life that feels meaningful to you.
Liz, this has been a fabulous episode. I'm super curious, what's your one thing from this episode?
Liz Moorehead (01:02:42.577)
I'm the one who suggested that this is how we end our episode. So I really have no one to blame but myself because you were absolutely right. I think this was the conversation not only you needed to have with yourself, but I also needed to have as well because it has been a crystallizing reminder of something that I hope our listeners are taking away from today.
How do you define your purpose? By not defining it.
It really is that simple. It's waiting for those moments where you feel in a way that does not need to be defined, I am exactly where I'm supposed to be and I am right on time. I was built for this moment. And the thing is, is that I think we have this expectation that it's going to be building to one moment. But that's how the human experience is all about. You will have chapters.
As we've discussed on previous episodes, you will have seasons and you will have multiple moments, I hope, where you say, I am exactly where I'm supposed to be and I'm right on time. And the metric for success there isn't that you can define it. You can just know it and be present in that moment.
George, what about you? What's the one thing you want our listeners to remember from today's really just incredible conversation?
George B. Thomas (01:04:07.958)
So for me, it is a reminder that the conversations that you need to have or hear will happen when they're supposed to happen. The funny thing is we have not tried to really control much of this podcast or the conversations that happen inside of it. And therefore there are these serendipitous moments where it just seems to align with where we're at.
in our life. The reason I'm bringing this up as my takeaway is because this podcast, these conversations are a great example of how purpose plays out. It has just unfolded along the way. It has just happened.
because we have not tried to control it. We have not even really tried to define it. We have tried to just build something that is open, authentic, conversational that people can learn from. What would happen if that's how you lived life on this journey beyond your default?